Illegal Workers - New Plan in the works

[ponto]

A letter from the Department of Homeland Security is sending waves of panic through the area. It warns employers they'll face serious penalties if they do not do everything they can to make sure the workers they're hiring are legal.

Right now, when a worker's Social Security number doesn't match his name on tax or other documents, the federal government sends employers a "no-match" letter.

A newly-proposed federal regulation tells businesses they will be held accountable if they ignore that letter and fail to resolve the discrepancy within 90 days.

Department of Homeland Security says the measures will help them crack down on employers who knowingly hire illegal workers.

There are more than eight million undocumented workers in the United States today earning over $500 billion a year and paying taxes on it.

This will disappear if the no-match program goes through because what it will do is force employers to fire eight million workers and we don't have anyone to replace them.

[tgwen]

Most Americans wouldn't do the jobs these undocumented workers are doing for the pay they are getting for it....

[Unregistered]

Most Americans wouldn't do the jobs these undocumented workers are doing for the pay they are getting for it....

So true. Companies have been getting rich off undocumented workers for so long that it would be impossible for them to adjust now. Heaven forbid these companies have to pay people a good waged for a hard days work.

The ACLU should be in on this one. Cramming 50 Mexicans into 1 small house so they can work for 5 dollars an hour, it is inhumane. People treat family pets better than they treat the human workers.

Reputable businesses have no problems paying the wage for American workers. It is the fly by night companies that can hide the workers that try to defeat this. Why aren't liberals screaming over the inhumane treatment of the people.

[Maxwells]

Amen to the guest post.....and another thing too..the sweat shops where USA Companies have their labor done cheaper so that they can make that big American Dollar.

[Brian K Beckett]

Most Americans wouldn't do the jobs these undocumented workers are doing for the pay they are getting for it....


Then if Americans are not going to do these jobs I dont want to have to pay Welfare

[acoolmom777]

We moved from a nice little town in Florida because we became the minority in a pool of "illegal workers"…..maybe I should have taken Spanish in High school, other then French…


Most Americans wouldn't do the jobs these undocumented workers are doing for the pay they are getting for it....

You would probably be shocked to how many would do their jobs…
I have picked strawberries, tomatoes and oranges also worked in a packinghouse and none is as hard as working tobacco


The ACLU should be in on this one. Cramming 50 Mexicans into 1 small house so they can work for 5 dollars an hour, it is inhumane. People treat family pets better than they treat the human workers.


Oh please….I don’t feel sorry for them at all…they get food stamps and when in the grocery store they have a cart full of meat and veggies….then they use their money to go next door and buy a cart full of beer…..also have you noticed that they drive new trucks or some other type of SUV……If the “50 Mexicans” put there money together they could live in a better place…..so I say this from past experiences…of working and living next to the “50 Mexicans”…..(no wait I can’t say it……against BBS Rules)

[tgwen]

True, there are people who abuse the welfare system - but there are also people who really need it (and even people who need it, but for some reason can't get it). I know if I was without a job - and really needed one - I would work where ever I could find one. However, I would rather work at a fast food restaurant for minimum wage - than break my back working in fields in the hot sun for less than minimum wage. As a matter of fact, I would rather work in the fast food restaurant (in the AC), than in a field somewhere even if I could make more than minimum wage working on a farm. Not saying that you would never catch me working on a farm. If the price was right - I would. I grew up working on my grandfather's farm. The only workers he had was me, my cousins, and a few boys from the local area. He sent Mexicans on their way - when they would come to the farm and ask for work. He would rather pay the local boys a little more, and know he was helping out someone in the community.

[Brian K Beckett]

I have no problem that welfare goes to people who try to help them selves I just have a problem with people living on welfare who dont want to work at all. I wish we could trade these people for the ones who come here that want to work.

[kdown]

This would bring thousands of Mexican truck drivers into our country. It is believed to be part of the North American Free Trade Agreement ( NAFTA )

Rumors of a Superhighway
By Michael Luo
Is there a secret plan being hatched by the federal government to construct a NAFTA super-highway from Mexico straight through to Canada, stopping off in Kansas City? Alongside immigration and Iraq, it is a question that is being posed with surprising regularity to the leading Republican presidential candidates by people who fear it is the first step toward the establishment of a new mega-country that would merge Mexico and the United States. A befuddled Rudolph W. Giuliani got the question recently in Concord, N.H., where he told a woman that he had never heard of the highway. Mitt Romney got it again last week in Story City, Iowa, responding he did not know of anyone in the government proposing such a plan, but if they are, “I’ll stop it.” But Representative Ron Paul, of Texas, a longshot for the Republican nomination, has spoken forebodingly of the plan, using as evidence a big new transportation network being proposed in Texas that would run from Mexico to Oklahoma

So, fact or fiction?

Federal officials say the latter. Elements of the concept have roots in ideas pushed by private and state-level entities promoting commerce across the continent, they said, adding the notion of a federal project for a behemoth highway bisecting the heart of the country and erasing America’s borders is an urban legend that has spread wildly on the Internet and talk radio. The candidates, though, still want you to know they are against it.

[acoolmom777]

Here is one for you on the Welfare subject….A few years back, my hubby got really ill and I was the only one working. My paycheck covered the monthly bills. After begging my husband to let me apply for some help (food stamps…we paid our taxes for years and never had the NEED to use help) for just a couple of months until the Doctor would release hubby to go back to work. I went down and applied….after more then an hour they turned me down because I had a older truck (in good shape) but was making payments on it ($127.00). They wanted me to turn the truck back in…..told me to get a cheap car to go back and forth to work in….I said “you mean one with no payment, but then I may have to put money in weekly just to keep it running”? He just laughed and said….”never heard it put that way, but yes…..
I left crying and think how “Uncle Sam” had let me down in my time of need…..I stopped for gas and was at the pump in the middle of 3 pumps….There was two women hollering back and forth at each other while getting their gas….this was their conversation (short) version….

“Hey Becky” (fake name) “did you get a job yet”?…

(Spanish)Sarah (fake name) “No did you”?….

(Sarah)….”No are you kidding I get more money off Welfare just staying home”…….
“I just go to places I know ain’t hirein”


I about drop the gas nozzle….I could not believe what I was hearing……I started praying right then (again)….

The next day when I checked my mail, I had 3 yes 3 checks….

1. 90.00 from electric company (deposit back for good payment record)
2. 52.00 from State Farms Insurance…(refund do for good standings with company)
3. $400.00 A check from someone I didn’t even know telling me God said he needed to write me this check.

That got us thru for the next 2 months until hubby got released for work……

My government has let me down more then once….but….God has always come thru for me.


So do I feel sorry for the Mexicans that come here and take our jobs, money and start business with minority business loans…and hire illegal relatives….ummm NO…No….again NO….

[jacquiez]

Im Married To A Mexican Man Who Wants To Work But Cant Because He Has No Social Security Card And No Work Permit. We Have A Lawyer Who Has Been Working On Our Case For 2 Years Now And Just Found Out That Since He Came Here Illegally That Now He Has To Go Back To Mexico. We Have Been Married For 5 Years And Im Not Well Enough To Travel And Stay In Mexico...we Dont Get No Food Stamps Or Welfare We Get By On My Ssi...which We Found Out Was Not Enough Money To Fix His Papers..we Are Low Income And Need A Sponser That Has Enough Money To Help Us Out. He Will Do Any Kind Of Work But Right Now He Is Afraid To Even Go Out Cause Immigration Can Take Him ..even If Were In Walmart Or Eating They Can Take Him Away....so Why Should I Have To Live This Way Cause I Feel In Love With Someone Who I Never Bothered To Ask If He Was A Illegal Alien...now They Want To Tear Us Apart Cause He Came Here To Work For His Family And A Better Life...he Agrees That Those Who Come Here And Sell Drugs And Get Welfare Should Go Back. Please If Any Body Out There Knows Any Thing New About Immmigration Laws Please Post It....

[Unregistered]

if you love him like you say then go back to his country with him because he does belong here legally,that was your choice.

[Maxwells]

acoolmom777....I am with you on this one. I too have worked since I was fourteen years old, my husband was hurt at work and was not able to return...(disabled.) I went to out local Goverment office to try and get help for two months...because all we had was my income to live on..and when you work from paycheck to paycheck that means alot. I was told I made $7.00 to much to apply for any assistance what so ever, food stamps, help with my gas, electric...zero. The lady told me if I had two or three kids it wouldbe different..I was furious..I started crying in her office and I pray to God these poeple are never in a situation where they feel hopeless and can not get any help after all the years I have worked...I told them I was not planning on making a living drawing foodstamps, or any kind of asisstance..So yes this makes me angry..we need to take care of our own..sorry if anyone is offeneded ( MY Rights Opinion Only) I am an AMERICAN Born and raised..Ditto

[TheMan]

Im Married To A Mexican Man Who Wants To Work But Cant Because He Has No Social Security Card And No Work Permit. We Have A Lawyer Who Has Been Working On Our Case For 2 Years Now And Just Found Out That Since He Came Here Illegally That Now He Has To Go Back To Mexico. We Have Been Married For 5 Years And Im Not Well Enough To Travel And Stay In Mexico...we Dont Get No Food Stamps Or Welfare We Get By On My Ssi...which We Found Out Was Not Enough Money To Fix His Papers..we Are Low Income And Need A Sponser That Has Enough Money To Help Us Out. He Will Do Any Kind Of Work But Right Now He Is Afraid To Even Go Out Cause Immigration Can Take Him ..even If Were In Walmart Or Eating They Can Take Him Away....so Why Should I Have To Live This Way Cause I Feel In Love With Someone Who I Never Bothered To Ask If He Was A Illegal Alien...now They Want To Tear Us Apart Cause He Came Here To Work For His Family And A Better Life...he Agrees That Those Who Come Here And Sell Drugs And Get Welfare Should Go Back. Please If Any Body Out There Knows Any Thing New About Immmigration Laws Please Post It....


Why would your husband fear deportation if he steps out of the house.. There are literally hundreds of Mexicans that frequent Wal-Mart in a daily basis and none of them are deported. Besides that INS will not pick illegals up unless there is a bus load or they are charged with a violent felony.. (Straight out of the INS' mouth.)

Love conquers all, and if you love each other, like you say, let him go back and get everything straightened out.. Then he can come back legally and take part in the American dream....

[Jeremy]

I'm always in the minority opinion when this subject comes up, but I measure the hype over Mexicans living in the US with the hype over every single non-English race throughout history. The same things said about Mexicans have been said about blacks, native Americans, but also (surprises some) the Irish and German immigrants. They take our jobs. They don't carry their weight. They're all criminals. It's hard to believe any of the so-called "facts" about the impact of illegals when you catch the people saying these facts in bold faced lies and distortions. They'll "mistakenly" say 30,000 on such and such statistic and it takes an independent fact checker to call them on the bull and find out it was actually 3,000 or something. Whatever facts might be in the statement are overshadowed by pure propaganda. It's a political strategy to be divisive, and the common person always needs someone to blame for their personal misfortunes. Blaming Mexicans is a fad. The truth is that Americans do far worse damage to their own lives than Mexicans will ever do to them.

[ponto]

There was an interesting statement that came up in this thread.

The American Dream (http://www.americansc.org.uk/online/American_Dream.htm)............

After living the American Dream off and on for a lot of years, which by the way, I believe is more of a nightmare, I believe that true life, liberty and happiness comes to those that embrace The Human Experience (http://www.arachnoid.com/levels/index.html) and leave the dreaming to one's sleeping hours.

[acoolmom777]

I'm always in the minority opinion when this subject comes up, but I measure the hype over Mexicans living in the US with the hype over every single non-English race throughout history. The same things said about Mexicans have been said about blacks, native Americans, but also (surprises some) the Irish and German immigrants. They take our jobs. They don't carry their weight. They're all criminals. It's hard to believe any of the so-called "facts" about the impact of illegals when you catch the people saying these facts in bold faced lies and distortions. They'll "mistakenly" say 30,000 on such and such statistic and it takes an independent fact checker to call them on the bull and find out it was actually 3,000 or something. Whatever facts might be in the statement are overshadowed by pure propaganda. It's a political strategy to be divisive, and the common person always needs someone to blame for their personal misfortunes. Blaming Mexicans is a fad. The truth is that Americans do far worse damage to their own lives than Mexicans will ever do to them.



Sorry Jeremy, I have to disagree with you on this one… blacks, native Americans, Irish and German immigrants all helped build this country, in a different “time” era…and brought something (good and bad) that added to what our country is today. They all earned the right to be here…..so to put them in the same list as the Mexicans…”I” feel is not true….

Our country is at a point where we can not “Share” our land our so called wealth, food, so on and so on….anymore. There has to be a stopping point….Let the Mexicans go back to their country, let them make a stand to change it….

We have got to “shut the doors/gates” at some point. I think the American people have had enough, and are now starting to speak their peace.

[ponto]

Did you know:

The federal government owns 1 out of 3 acres of all the land in the United States.

In fact, they own 92% of Nevada, so if they want to let people into the United States, they have the land, let them herd the new arrivals to some of their land and do as they please. They will anyway............

But by all means, let the people who own the other 2/3 make their own decision.

[Jeremy]

They all earned the right to be here…..so to put them in the same list as the Mexicans…”I” feel is not true….

I won't go in-depth because I realize it's a minority opinion and I don't have the energy to defend it :), but I would argue that anyone who tries to make a life out of living in this country contributes in some way, and in doing so earns the right. Mexican immigrants don't sit around doing nothing (despite the popular view). They work very hard. Documentation is almost a side item.

Solving the actual problems related to undocumented workers probably needs to address the documentation, but the popular view doesn't have anything to do with documentation. It has to do with characterizations (lazy, don't carry their weight, etc.). All of those are obviously false, because undocumented means they actually do take the grunt jobs. If we're going to actually characterize them, they work a lot harder than many Americans.

In my minority view, there's a difference between birthright and earned-right. I'm an American by birthright. Many non-Americans are Americans by earned-right. A lot of people believe that the "earned"-right means going through all of the procedures for documentation, and maybe that's true, but that's not my view. That's just paperwork. I'm very blue collar on this point and feel that out there working in the fields means a lot more than a piece of paper.

[tkcomer]

The big difference I see is the vast majority of the people (Our families) left their home country for whatever reason and did so legally. I have no problem with legal immigration. Illegal on the other hand is a different story. They're breaking the law plain and simple. No if and or butts about it. If they want to come here legally, no problem once again. But they don't. They don't want to take the time or expense to become citizens of this country. To become a citizen legally is a lot of work, something they don't want to do. And lets face it. They don't come here and do crappy jobs because they want to. They do it because of their corrupt governments and the way their countries are run. And a lot of those corrupt countries are "friends" of this one. You can discuss pluses and minuses all day long. I for one don't like higher insurance premiums on health care and higher taxes so somebody can beat the system for cheap labor. We did these jobs before they showed up and we'll do it again.

[wmjsmallwood]

all i can say on this is that if there is a illegal living here ,then some one ,a neighbor,a farmer,a renter,some one knows about it and this person makes no effort to have this person made to get legal ,then that is why we are in this shape,,,every person deserves a chance !but let them do it legal and we will not have this problem ,please,we were all from another place before our forefathers came here ,lets keep america the place of hope,,,just my thoughs

[Chuck]

Press two for Spanish is not for the legal Hispanic population. they speak enough for the most part.

Yes our Country was founded on illegal immigration but was something that had to end. It had to end due to economics. A country can only support so many people. If that number is met by illegal migration then many new factors must happen. Eventually even Government Population Control.

Right now it may seem like we have the room, yes. But most of us feel the extra tax burden on the system. Most illegal Mexicans don't work.

They don't have status so they are not counted on the census. The cause and effect for each area is different. We have a population of about 1000 (If not more) Hispanics that are not counted.

Welfare means I pay to raise my kids and yours. I don't mind Welfare for a couple of years but it should not be a career choice.

[acoolmom777]

I still stand strong by my 3 previous post.....

[Jeremy]

I still don't know where you guys get the "most illegal Mexicans don't work" thing. The statistics are hard to come by because (a little obvious) undocumented workers aren't too census friendly, but one thing that does show up in all the studies is that they come here to work. The myth that they come here to hop on welfare is demonstrably false. The same documentation that they need to get on welfare (which -most- do not obtain) is the same documentation they need to get higher paying jobs (which -most- do not obtain). Most are undocumented (forged or otherwise), hence most are not on welfare.

[TheMan]

Well.. it may be more accurate to say that most illegal Mexicans don't pay income tax... either way, there is good and bad in every ethnic group... Seems that we all see the "bad" Mexicans, not the good. I have met many many many Mexicans I would call friend.. But I have met several others that are alcoholics, won't work, beat their wives, and are a burden on our society..

Sound like allot of Americans I know....

[acoolmom777]

agree with you "TheMan"....
but I guess coming from Florida and having a migrant camp built right next to my house…..kind of showed me first hand how some live their lives here…..what I saw was …..the legal migrants brought their illegal families in and the housing that was for a family of 5 became 15…..I never said once that the legal Mexicans didn’t work hard….but hello….so do I

[Jeremy]

And all I'm saying is take the hype with a grain of salt :) I'm not saying there's not real problems here. There are, and they're really complicated ones. For example, all the second-generation illegals born on US soil are actually legal. They're just as American as we are. My sole point is that these real issues are overshadowed by the (imho) made up ones. Bogus stats on something everyone admits is unstatable (<-is that a word?). Bogus characterizations, etc. That's why I call it "hype". You have to cut through the hype to get at the real issues and find solutions. I'm not that confident that it's all that easy.

[acoolmom777]

[QUOTE=Jeremy;38737] For example, all the second-generation illegals born on US soil are actually legal. QUOTE]




True story....My brother was born in Japan...but both my parents are American....does that make him Japanese...no of course not....he was born to American parents.....even if your quote is right...it is a government rule not a true "ethnic" rule...
if the parents are illegal so should the kids be......

Here is food for thought.......


"The message Dr. Cosman delivered to a standing-room only crowd should be heard by all Americans. She spoke about the 84 California hospitals that closed between 1994 and 2003 because EMTALA, the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act, requires every emergency room to treat every patient coming with an "emergency" (including childbirth) even if unable to pay and even if illegally in the United States.
The law is tough; hospitals and doctors are fined up to $50,000 for refusing to treat. This unfunded federal mandate has caused dozens of hospitals to go bankrupt.
Dr. Cosman, who is both a Ph.D. and a lawyer, described the infectious diseases now spreading across the United States. Contagious diseases that our country wiped out years ago, such as malaria, polio, tuberculosis, and hepatitis, and rare diseases of Third World poverty such as leprosy, Chagas Disease, and Dengue Fever, are coming in.
The Centers for Disease Control reported 38,291 California cases of tuberculosis that included Multiple Drug Resistant Tuberculosis, which is 60 percent fatal and for which treatment costs $200,000 to $1,200,000 per patient. Illegal aliens are also bringing in syphilis and gonorrhea".

hummmmmm

[Jeremy]

Ethnically no one's American. American is a nationality, not a race ;) It really is a complicated situation, though, with no easy answer. Technically and legally they are US citizens completely and with all due rights, and I doubt the US will revoke their citizenship (or has the Constitutional authority to do so).

[acoolmom777]

It's not complicated....If you are not an American Citizen.....get out....

9/11 should have closed America's open arms......I vote for Bush...but....I also thought we should have closed all boarders and combed our country, every nook and cranny of it....and all that didn't have American Citizenship should have been booted out....right then and there...

[Jeremy]

And then you're left with hundreds of thousands of "orphaned" legal citizens cared for at taxpayer's expense. It's pretty complicated.

[acoolmom777]

Exactly…. That means we have thousands and thousands of illegal migrants…..and that is the problem that makes everything complicated…..

[Maxwells]

I totally agree..to many illegal immigrants...They need to be checked out and checked back to where they came from.

[Chuck]

And then you're left with hundreds of thousands of "orphaned" legal citizens cared for at taxpayer's expense. It's pretty complicated.

We already are taking care of these "orphaned legal citizens". The documentary shows on popularizing Illegal Migrant workers, saying the do jobs Americans won't do fail to tell you that they go through 5 workers to find 1 good worker. These leaves 4 to become a problem or burden.

How they become a burden it to marry locally, have children and let the new found wife draw welfare. This is documented through the welfare system by a nationality check box for the child compared to that of the mother.

Working in public service you can see the problem 1st hand but are limited on what you can do. Working public service in Calif. I can tell you that you are correct, they don't like to answer status questions. An Illegal will turn violent on you in a heartbeat.

[Maxwells]

I would like to know why this isn't checked into more thourghly and have these immigrants sent back to their own country. I don't like working for years and paying taxes for someone to come into this country illegally and me pay for them to sit on their you know whats, have children everytime they can....This is not only a probelm with the immigrants either.

[TheMan]

I was told by an INS employee... That I, as a police officer, can not ask a non-American for their green card, or even their immigration status.. So who's side is the government on?

[acoolmom777]

this side...(|)

[jacquiez]

When I Said My Husband Was Worried About Going Out..was Cause We Just Returned From Texas And We Know For A Fact Ins Can Get You From Walmart Or Your Own Home If They Want. Yes Its If You Commit A Crime But Now Its Even If You Haven't Done Anything. It Just Seems To Me That They Are Picking More On The Mexican Illegals Than Any Other Illegals In The Us...i Worked Paid My Taxes And Now That Im On Ssi Its Hard But We Make It. I Have Never Applied For Any Welfare Or Anything Always Took Care Of Myself So I Want The Same For My Husband. I Want Him To Work Hard And Take Care Of Us..we Don't Need Any Goverment Asst. If He Gets A Good Job....any Way I Do Agree That He Should Go Back To Mexico And Come Back Over Here Legally ...but It Could Take 5 Years For Him To Get His Papers From Over There Cause The Goverment There...so I Should Like That And Our Son Should Grow Up Without His Father. Its Not Only Hard For Me But Our 7 Year Old Son Who Worries About His Dad Going Away....its All In Gods Hands Right Now So Im Not Sure Whats Going To Happen But I Do Know That The Farmers Here Will Be The Ones That Suffer The Most...i Know Right Now That There Are Less Mexicans In The Maysville Area Cause Of Ins And They Are Scared...so Now There Are Farmers Needing Help And Nobody Is Helping Them....so Now The People That Complained About No Work Well There Is Plenty Of Farm Work To Do...tob. Needs To Be Cut And Hung ..lot Of Construction Jobs Now...landscaping Jobs...cause The Mexicans That Did Work Cant Cause They Were In The Wrong Being Here Illegally So Now Lots Of Jobs To Do For The Americans Now....

[bubbysgarage]

So who's side is the government on?

The criminals side. If you enter this country illegially then you have commited a crime regardless of whether it was yesterday or 10 years ago. If you want to come here that badly then do as the rest of the legals have done. Don't know bout the rest of you but I'm tired of having to push "1" for english. If you haven't noticed the legals are becoming the minority in this country.

[anb_swrk]

This is my only comment. Mexians are not the only illegals here! And we need to remember that not all those that you see in the area are illegal. There are some who have done it right. Just be careful when bashing your neighbor... they do have feelings too! Not all are alcholics, not all are using the government, and the majority are not bad individuals.

I support anyone trying to better their life and the life of their family. I have friends from Austria, Africa and other places throughout the world and the only reason they are legal is b/c of education, but as soon as they are done they are illegal. I feel that there should be some exceptions with the process for those that have been here working or in school to make it easier for them to receive there citizenship.

[Jeremy]

An Illegal will turn violent on you in a heartbeat.

Huh?

[acoolmom777]

No matter where you are from....

Illegal... is used to describe something that is prohibited or not authorized by law or, more generally, by rules specific to a particular situation....


illegal is illegal.....

[anb_swrk]

that's very true acoolmom777 - but illegal also has degrees and for those that are here and not causing problems within the legal system, etc. should have the option to stay here and get their paper work approved more quickly if they are working, providing for their family, and living a productive life not only for themselves but within the community.

[bubbysgarage]

that's very true acoolmom777 - but illegal also has degrees and for those that are here and not causing problems within the legal system, etc. should have the option to stay here and get their paper work approved more quickly if they are working, providing for their family, and living a productive life not only for themselves but within the community.


If they wanted to be here to better them selves or their family they should have done the paperwork before they left their home country. There are a lot of people of other nationalities that did their paperwork the legal way to get here. I agree with acoolmom777 illegal is illegal period.

[kdown]

Most Americans feel this way

[Maxwells]

Yep.....

[acoolmom777]

love the pic...lol

[bubbysgarage]

the pic is the truth.

[Chuck]

Huh?

I don't know, The whole statement makes sense to me.

Working in public service you can see the problem 1st hand but are limited on what you can do. Working public service in Calif. I can tell you that you are correct, they don't like to answer status questions. An Illegal Alien will turn violent on you in a heartbeat.

Added the word "Alien"

[Jeremy]

I mean "huh?" that they'll turn violent in a heartbeat. This is what I mean about actual issues (undocumented, non-tax contributing, lack of control on the amount of immigration, drain on resources) versus the totally made up ones that are what I collectively call political hype:


They're lazy
They don't work
They're all on welfare
They're all immoral
They hate America and want to take over
They're all diseased
They'll go violent in a heartbeat
Etc.


I'm sorry, but that's just a load of you know what to sell a political position.

[TheMan]

How can ya say that an illegal should be able to stay if they are working and not causing problems? First.. They aren't paying taxes.. like most all Americans.. and second.. They are not here legally, didn't come by plane, boat or some other normal mode of transport. They came by swimming a river, jumping a fence, and out running boarder patrol.. That in an of it's self is a crime.. A felony to be exact.. And to say the farmers will suffer is laughable.. **** they are already suffering.. and it has nothing to do with a lack of workers..

Just come here like my forefathers did.. Legally, be proud to take the tests, learn the language, and call your self an American.. Just because they/them/whatever.. wants to make this their home, does not give them the right to picket Washington, lobby for rights they shouldn't have to begin with, or change our national language..

Illegal Mexicans will turn violent in a heartbeat when asked about their immigration status....It's not political hype, it's not made up, it's not an ethnic bias.. It's the truth..

I have scars to prove it Jeremy

As far as the rest...

1) proven that they ain't lazy.. they work some of the crappiest jobs known to man.

2) Ever one I've ever met is either working or looking for work.

3) Impossible to be on welfare if your not an American citizen.. However, your wife or husband can be.. Even your American born child...

4)Define moratlity... I won't.. to each their own as long as it's not hurting others.

5) If they hate America so much why do they risk life and limb to come live here..?

6)Ain't met an illegal yet that has be diseased.. Well with the exception of TB.. which seems to be something they contract rather easily..

7) I answered this one above.. It's no myth...

[bubbysgarage]

My point exactly.

[Jeremy]

How can ya say that an illegal should be able to stay if they are working and not causing problems?

I didn't say that. I am only saying that it's not black and white, is complicated, and that broad generalizations have been made by politicians and the media that aren't backed by statistics and have in some cases been totally fabricated to push an agenda.

(Your own experience notwithstanding, and I truly hope you fully recovered and "took care of" the guy -- I'm not a complete liberal pansy ;))

[TheMan]

Actually sir, that first comment wasn't directed toward you.. I actually agree with you on one level or the other, except the violence towards officers thing...

[Jeremy]

Police officers should definitely not be used as meatshields... no disagreement there :)

[Chuck]

Jeremy, I have the knife cuts to to support my statement. Many are visable on my arms. These are Documented and Stat-able under officers injured in the line of duty. Or is your opinion like that of the judge who said too me "You should expect this in your line of work."

I wish I could tell you that my experiences are isolated, they are not.

[Maxwells]

Can someone please tell me why we or may I say the Goverment let's this problem to continue, they know what's going on....It's time to get serious and take back our COUNTRY......

[bubbysgarage]

good question.

[Jeremy]

Or is your opinion like that of the judge who said too me "You should expect this in your line of work."

No, I don't feel that way. Why would anyone feel that way? :confused:

But I'm still not going to support a statement that illegals will turn all pitbull in a heartbeat either. Sorry, that's just too broad of a generalization. I'm sure that you guys, in your line of work, encountered illegals that didn't go violent in a heartbeat, and probably encountered more of those guys than those who did, so why does the default go to them being pitbulls?

I don't know. Like I said at the beginning, it's a minority opinion, and I'm comfortable with that. I'm not out to change anyone's mind.

[acoolmom777]

<----- gives Jeremy a plane ticket to Tampa Florida then rents him a car to drive 45 minutes south......

Spend two weeks there and then tell us again about the "pitbull" theory

[Jeremy]

<----- gives Jeremy a plane ticket to Tampa Florida then rents him a car to drive 45 minutes south......

Spend two weeks there and then tell us again about the "pitbull" theory

I lived in Lakeland for two years and my in-laws still live there, so thanks! I'd be happy to take the ticket :Banane44:

That said:

Los Angeles estimated population in 2004 was

12,977,272

Los Angeles estimated population of Hispanic or Latino (Mexican or not, legal or not)

4,613,450

Violent crimes committed in 2004 in Los Angeles

654

Even if each violent crime was committed by a Hispanic, that's 4,612,796 Hispanics that did not commit a violent crime that year.

[TheMan]

I wasn't referring to violent crime tendencies.. I was referring to acts against peace officers. It has been my experience, that when asked of immigration status.. Those that are not legal, had tendencies to avoid arrest, no matter what the crime, and those tendencies were generally violent in nature..

Sure I have met plenty of Mexicans, both legal and illegal that were not this way in general, but of those, most were not asked about their status..

[Jeremy]

I'd imagine that's more accurate. Let me say again for those who don't read all the posts that peace officers are not to be used as meatshields :)