Pot arrest made in Mason County; Ohio drug ring sting carried out

[Chuck]

Click Here to Watch Video of Search Warrant. (http://www.maysvillekybbs.com/forums/view.php?pg=ledger_hh)

Police on both sides of the Ohio River made drug arrests recently, cracking down on the area's illegal narcotics problem.

Two people were arrested on drug charges following a traffic stop Monday afternoon by Mason County Sheriff Patrick Boggs.

According to Boggs, he stopped a vehicle owned by Martha Holmes, 33, of Maysville for failure to wear a seat belt and careless driving along Tuckahoe Road. In addition to Holmes, Tomico Slater, 23, also of Maysville was in the vehicle, a 1994 white Cadillac.

Upon further investigation Boggs said a pound and a half of marijuana was discovered in the vehicle.

Police executed a search warrant on Slater and Holmes' residence in Hill City Trailer Park in Maysville and discovered various drug paraphernalia and small amounts of marijuana in the residence, Boggs said.

Holmes and Slater were both arrested and lodged in the Mason County Detention Center and charged with trafficking in marijuana eight ounces or over. In addition, Holmes was charged with failure to wear a seat belt and careless driving.

A canine unit was utilized during the search of the residence. Assisting Boggs with the investigation was the Maysville Police Department and Buffalo Trace Narcotics Task Force.

Boggs said the incident remains under investigation.

Source (http://www.maysville-online.com/articles/2007/01/29/local_news/2951drug.txt)

[mark]

.............looks like my vote counted this last time.

Great job new sheriff..............see ya mark

[Foxy]

Agreed Mark! I am glad they are outta there. Just curious? I think they only lived at the park for a little while, I wonder if a simple call to the local police could have alerted the park manager that there were dealers wanting to rent?

[SomeDude]

.............looks like my vote counted this last time.

Great job new sheriff..............see ya mark

Agreed...Patrick Boggs is doing a great job!!

[Chuck]

Agreed...Patrick Boggs is doing a great job!!


The man has been working since the day he took office. I have a feeling Patrick is going to make Curtis buy a new Jail. I know Curtis up for that. He has been working since he took office.


As far as the trailer park it is long from over. Expect more in the News about that place in the near future....

[Daphne]

.............looks like my vote counted this last time.

Great job new sheriff..............see ya mark


Great job to our new Sheriff Boggs and the MPD for catching these people.

[Confucius]

Police executed a search warrant on Slater and Holmes' residence in Hill City Trailer Park in Maysville and discovered various drug paraphernalia and small amounts of marijuana in the residence, Boggs said.

Slater and Holmes' haven't even lived at this location two weeks before being busted. This is just another fine example of the management/owner situation at this location. I am sure that they will say that they checked these people out, but it is obvious that they don't have a clue as to what they are doing.

I would be willing to bet that some of neighbors at this location had their suspicion of these tenants and their unlawful behavior unlike the management/owner did.

I think that someone needs to step up and do something about this neighborhood, before innocent people get hurt. I could just about bet that the crime rate in this neighborhood has gone up 200% with the current management/owner situation.

I know, I know crime happens everywhere but in the last four months have you had a shooting, stabbing, drug bust, etc within a 1 block radius of where you live? I doubt very seriously most in this town could admit that they had this happen this close to them.

I feel sorry for the people that lived in the neighborhood when it was a quiet place to live and are still there now when it has went to pot. These are the innocent people that I am referring to, people that own their homes and are trying to make a living the best they can. Now they have god knows who living in there and apparently not even the management/owner has the decency to respect these people that puts the green in their hands.

Great job by the Sheriif's Office and the Maysville Police on getting these people where they belong, even if it was only for a day or two.

[canaco]

Another fine job from Maysville Police it is so refreshing to be able to add the Mason County Sheriffs office to the list. Team work is something new in Mason County. Keep up the good team work.

[wmjsmallwood]

Sheriff Boggs ,you make me proud i voted for you ,please ,,,you and all the departments involved ,keep up the good work ,and make these kinda people not wanna live in our county to influence our children,its hard enough to raise them to wanna be productuctive adults with out drugs. As a member of this community and a proud parent of 3 honor roll students ,i thank you

[drago]

eh I would be more impressed if they had busted some of the many crack dealers here in town....the potheads don't scare me as much as the crackheads do.

[kybikertrash]

drago.......my thoughts exactly. I don't worry about the pot-heads nearly as much as I do the crack-heads. But it is good to see the police doing something about the drug problem around here. I hope this leads to bigger and better drug busts. We need to get rid of the more serious drugs on our streets!

[Shrek]

Drugs are drugs to me. These guys were probably out restocking the shelves and got caught between pickups.

Some Dealers are so sly you have to get them when you can with whatever they got on them. Even when you know they are bigger than that.

I know for a fact this Tomico Slater guys past record includes an arrest for Aggravated Armed Robbery. I would guess he is not a nice person for a POT dealer.

We need to clean up all our neighborhoods in town.

Boy's and Girl's there's a new Sheriff in this swamp. He goes by the name of Boggs and this guy is going to be kick'in *** and taking names.
Shrek III

[snowtiger]

Well, I would just as soon see marijuana legalized, but that's another whole ball of wax. I agree that the crack/cocaine problem needs to be dealt with. I've known so many "potheads" and they are BASICALLY calm and keep to themselves. Yeah, by the way, I don't smoke it either.

Even though I disagree with this particular law, good work for our new sheriff, whom I also voted for :)

[Chuck]

I know for a fact this Tomico Slater guys past record includes an arrest for Aggravated Armed Robbery. I would guess he is not a nice person for a POT dealer.


Boy's and Girl's there's a new Sheriff in this swamp. He goes by the name of Boggs and this guy is going to be kick'in *** and taking names.
Shrek III

I did call MPD and verify that this is true.

I just like the Boggs statement so I quoted it too. lol

[Gemini]

eh I would be more impressed if they had busted some of the many crack dealers here in town....the potheads don't scare me as much as the crackheads do.

Two Rumors I heard was that (1) these people were dealing more than pot. As Shrek said they were caught with what they had at the time of the bust. (2) They had previously been convicted of dealing cocaine. Which would make sense as to why they hadn't lived in Hill City 2 weeks before getting busted AGAIN. Stupid is as stupid does, some people never learn.

Hill City is for the most part rental property, Right? So, like Confucius I'm also wondering how a known covicted drug dealer slipped by the screening process. Anyone have a guess...gotta jet.

[Sofa King]

Marijuana is a gateway drug. Thats a undisputed fact. To legalize it brings into play a whole new can of worms. And if you think that they were just transporting weed.. We are all in trouble.

Oh yeah... Great job Sheriff Boggs, Maysville Police, and BT Narc Task force! Good to see my money and vote being put to good use!

[canaco]

The answer is simple. The guy that owns this trailer park rents trailers because he has a strong desire to make a profit. Now I will take a guess here but I believe the people in this town with good jobs with real companies really don't need to rent a trailer from him to call home. This leave the people in town that will get to know the Maysville Police Officers by their 1st names. The rest of us will still need to call them Officer.


If you are surprised that drug dealers live in a trailer park or at the housing projects, no one else in town is. If I want to buy drug these would be the 1st place you would look.

Now before you beat me with a ball bat or pistol whip me, I know there are many good people that live in both places. I don't mean to belittle any hard working person. I myself live in a double wide just not in a trailer park.

You have to admit that both places are the pereferred housing of criminals.

[Gemini]

The answer is simple. The guy that owns this trailer park rents trailers because he has a strong desire to make a profit. Now I will take a guess here but I believe the people in this town with good jobs with real companies really don't need to rent a trailer from him to call home. This leave the people in town that will get to know the Maysville Police Officers by their 1st names. The rest of us will still need to call them Officer.


If you are surprised that drug dealers live in a trailer park or at the housing projects, no one else in town is. If I want to buy drug these would be the 1st place you would look.

Now before you beat me with a ball bat or pistol whip me, I know there are many good people that live in both places. I don't mean to belittle any hard working person. I myself live in a double wide just not in a trailer park.

You have to admit that both places are the pereferred housing of criminals.

Ok, so lets let all the trash move in to the trailer park because the owner needs to make a profit and doesn't care enough to do a criminal back ground check. We can't leave the criminals out on the street, the housing authority does criminal back ground checks. You can not live in government assistant housing if you have been convicted of a felony or drug charge. In defense for the hard working or maybe just a family trying to get on their feet that was born without a silver spoon in their mouth. Just because bad things happen to good people, doesn't mean they should have to live among filth and crime. Also no neighborhood is without crime, maybe you just don't know about it. I really hope you don't think only bottom feeders use drugs. How many times have you heard on the news or read in the news paper about a celebrity or politician getting arrested for drugs. Maybe they should go live in a trailer park or section 8 housing where they best fit in. Total and typical stereotype...

[canaco]

All I said was where would you expect to find drugs? I stated that the guy that owns the trailer park wants to make a profit so his standards are a little lower when it comes to clients.

I knew that I would strike a nerve with someone that live in this park or the housing projects. Our projects are not exempt from this problem. I bet you will find people that have slipped through the cracks there too.

I do owe an apology to some of the high quality trailer parks like the one in Highland Heights. I did not mean that parks like this are included with my statement. I also did not mean to imply that the people or the police should give up. I was just saying look around, where would you expect to find drugs?

Sorry if your offended.

[Gemini]

All I said was where would you expect to find drugs? I stated that the guy that owns the trailer park wants to make a profit so his standards are a little lower when it comes to clients.

I knew that I would strike a nerve with someone that live in this park or the housing projects. Our projects are not exempt from this problem. I bet you will find people that have slipped through the cracks there too.

I do owe an apology to some of the high quality trailer parks like the one in Highland Heights. I did not mean that parks like this are included with my statement. I also did not mean to imply that the people or the police should give up. I was just saying look around, where would you expect to find drugs?

Sorry if your offended.

I'm not offended at all. What drew my attention to your post was your tone and how you perceive people who may or may not be less fortunate than yourself. I had hoped to make you see the bigger picture and also realize this doesn't just happen in trailer courts and section 8 housing. So call me whatever you want for taking up for these people. I have a right to my opinion as well as you do. BTW...most drug dealers live in rental houses because the owners don't invest the time nor money to investigate their tenants properly. They only care about that monthly check so they can make their mortgage(s).

[Sofa King]

Housing Authority tries it's best to keep the unsavories out. But you can't keep their 18 year old girlfriends from getting section eight and them moving in with her.

[snowtiger]

"Marijuana is a gateway drug. Thats a undisputed fact. To legalize it brings into play a whole new can of worms. And if you think that they were just transporting weed.. We are all in trouble."

Never said anything about what THOSE people were doing, did I? Just said that MOST of the people I've ever known only did marijuana. Maybe you should reread my post.

[Confucius]

Most people have to go through more drug tests and background checks and whatever else just to get a stinking $8.00 an hour job. You would think that these slum lords would do something similiar, if they want decent tenants living on their property. But I guess they like losing money on their investments from, remodeling and those dead beat tenants that won't pay their stinking rent.

It doesn't matter to me if these people were just caught with pot, I am sure that is just what they had at the time. At least they were caught and some of the families in that location can sleep a little better a night knowing that they don't have this activity and dangerous criminals beating on their door at all hours of the night. At least there is one or two less now.

[Sofa King]

"Never said anything about what THOSE people were doing, did I? Just said that MOST of the people I've ever known only did marijuana. Maybe you should reread my post."

No you said it should be legalized. " Well, I would just as soon see marijuana legalized, but that's another whole ball of wax." Maybe you should re-reread my post instead of getting all defensive.

[snowtiger]

Didn't get defensive, just wanted to clarify what I said because your quote and reply to my post didn't make any sense to what I had actually written.

[kybikertrash]

I still have to agree with sofa king about marijuana....most people I've known that smoked pot were non- violent. I too agree that it is possible, if not likely, that they were doing more than selling pot, but the search warrant failed to produce anything other than more pot, which is shame because if they have been selling other drugs, they pretty much got away with it.

I myself don't get the point of doing drugs. Waste of time, waste of money, waste of brain cells. Ruins you life.

[Bengals_Mama]

Well... if Marijuana was legal you all would be sitting on the couch, lighting up, eating doritos, and laughing your arses off right now instead of arguing....

[Sofa King]

arguing is more fun...

[Black Sheep]

First of all, Good job Sheriff Boggs. I'm glad to see my vote wasn't wasted.
The trailer park in question was in fact a very nice place to live several years ago before the current Park Mangers took over. I have had ties to some residents in that Park for most of my life. They are good decent people who have lived there for years and raised families there. It used to be a place where everyone knew everyone else; you could let your kids outside to play with the other kids and you weren't afraid for them to go spend time inside the homes of the other residents. Most of the families that lived there years ago owned their own mobile homes and some have eventually moved on with the purchase of their own piece of land somewhere or into a house. Since then the owner or previous owner started moving in trailers to rent, which was fine as long as there was a respectable park manager to run things and there used to be. He and his family did a wonderful job of taking care of the park and making sure that all the rules were followed(one of which was if you were convicted of a crime you were out). Unfortunately he passed away and the park has fallen into the hands of the current park managers who I'm afraid at best don't have a clue what they are doing or at worst are connected to everything that is going on there now. Which from everything I've heard would not be surprising since it seems that several of the newer tenants are either related to them or friends of theirs. Since they have taken over it seems like there have been police constantly in and out of the park on a weekly if not daily basis. There have been noise ordinance complaints, drug busts, stabbings, assaults, and various other crimes. That's not even including the hundreds of other nuisances the residents are forced to live with. It is at a point where most of the older residents rarely step foot outside their doors unless it's to leave and keep their doors locked 24 hours a day. They have no one to make complaints to in fear that the person they are complaining about is connected to the park managers, the owner doesn't seem to care whats going on either, and most can't afford to just pack up their mobile home and move. Having a mobile home moved is not a cheap undertaking and there is also the problem of finding a place to move it to especially if it's an older model one since most newer trailer parks have rules set as to how old a mobile home moving in can be. The owner needs to wake up and take a look at what's going on and make some changes soon before it comes to a point where he has to close the park and several good people are left trying to pick up the mess it's made of their lives. And a heads up to the local law enforcement agencies(though I doubt they really need it), I'd keep a close eye on the goings on in this location as well as on anyone that the new managers have rented to since they have been running the place.

[Foxy]

Very true, welcome to the BBS Black Sheep, and the other newbies. Stick around and voice your opinions again!!
I live there and have since the new managers, I however do not do, deal, or partake in any drugs or alcoholic beverages. And I am not related to the managers, yet, it would seem that I get a lot of harassment from the manager and her family and friends. I would think that there are tenants that they need to worry about aside from my hard working family.
My children do not go out and play with alto of the kids, because they have potty mouths, and are rude and arrogant. Not all the kids here, but most. Heck every time there is a snow day, there is a child about 5 years old out riding his bike in the snow, in the cold alone with out adult supervision.

[Daphne]

They are good decent people who have lived there for years and raised families there. It used to be a place where everyone knew everyone else; you could let your kids outside to play with the other kids and you weren't afraid for them to go spend time inside the homes of the other residents. Most of the families that lived there years ago owned their own mobile homes and some have eventually moved on with the purchase of their own piece of land somewhere or into a house. Since then the owner or previous owner started moving in trailers to rent, which was fine as long as there was a respectable park manager to run things and there used to be. He and his family did a wonderful job of taking care of the park and making sure that all the rules were followed(one of which was if you were convicted of a crime you were out). Unfortunately he passed away and the park has fallen into the hands of the current park managers who I'm afraid at best don't have a clue what they are doing or at worst are connected to everything that is going on there now.

I am one who unfortunately has lived there my entire life along with these tenants that you are referring to. I was one of those kids who could go outside and play and my parents would not have to worry. I appreciate the kind words regarding my father. He definately kept tenants in line, he was liked by most and hated by a few, but it comes with the job. My father never got much for taking care of the park for 3 decades or more.

Back then the owner didn't want anyone to know who the owner was and he didn't really want a say with anything that went on and it worked great back then. But the that same owner decided that he wanted more and then started renting trailers and it has been downhill ever since. The owner of the park want control of who he rents too now, which is his right, but at the same time he doesn't live there so he doesn't know everything that goes on there now. If he were to put his family there I am sure that he wouldn't put up with the crap that is going on there now. But we won't have to worry about that because he won't put is family in harms way.

Black Sheep welcome to the board, its nice to know that I am not the only one who remembers that this park used to be a nice place to live.

[Black Sheep]

Thanks for the welcome!
Foxy, I meant no offense;that was said regarding the fact that all the trouble seems to come from the rental units and mostly recent renters. An attempt at being diplomatic and not saying trailer #'s blah, blah, and blah. LOL! I'm sure you know the ones I'm referring to. I know that there have been a few decent people that has rented there since then but it seems that unfortunately they don't seem to last very long there and I have heard quite a few others say that about the harassment as well. And I know what you mean about the kids since I am often out there visiting. I even saw the kid I think you are talking about out today riding his bike in the road and the yards with all this snow and vehicles sliding about in the parking lot and no adult in site. I have on several occasions had kids of various ages ride bikes and skateboards out in front of my car as well as running out in front of it or just flat out playing in the middle of the road and refusing to move. It's a miracle that one of them hasn't been hit. And yes they do seem to think that every yard in the park is theirs to play in. As for the potty mouth, yes I have heard quite a bit of that from the kids running around outside as well. But you know what can you expect from the kids when you have personally seen with your own two eyes the "responsible" adult screaming obscenities at them. Kids learn what they live. Makes you wonder doesn't it? I wish you the best of luck in living there if you decide to stick it out; like I said few of the decent renters do.
Daphne, it's obvious from the posts that I've read so far on these threads that we aren't the only two who remember what a nice place the park used to be. I spent a few summers with an Aunt that used to live there several years ago in the late 70s & early 80s and I think you are one of the kids that my cousins and I used to play with back then. From what I remember it was a nice little community and nothing like it is now. I met your Father a few times and I always liked him; I was sorry to hear about it when he passed away. It was a loss for the entire park as well considering all that has happened there since then. Hopefully things will settle down there and all the decent law abiding citizens that live there can have some peace soon.

[Foxy]

Awe, you will come to find I don't get offended easily... but I do often get picked on alot. It is all good!
And yup, he was out again today with his brother? And I was sliding all over the place this morning. Freaking out looking for those 2 to make sure they were out of my way.
And I don't plan on sticking it out, we are looking to buy a house now.

[DecupldSolutions]

Marijuana is a gateway drug. Thats a undisputed fact. To legalize it brings into play a whole new can of worms. And if you think that they were just transporting weed.. We are all in trouble.

Oh yeah... Great job Sheriff Boggs, Maysville Police, and BT Narc Task force! Good to see my money and vote being put to good use!


Distortion 7: Marijuana is a gateway drug that leads to heroin and cocaine addiction.

False. The ?gateway? claim is a myth. Marijuana is the most widely used illicit drug so it is very likely that people who use less commonly-used drugs will have also tried marijuana. That does not mean marijuana led to hard drug use. The research indicates most marijuana users do not go onto use hard drugs; marijuana is more properly viewed as a strainer that catches most illicit drug users and they go no further. The numbers bear out these findings: According to the federal government 76.3 million people have tried marijuana, while only 2.78 million have ever tried heroin in their lifetimes and only 5.3 million have ever tried cocaine in their lives. The figures for monthly use are similar: 10.7 million Americans admit to being regular marijuana users, yet only 1.2 million admit to using cocaine each month - 1 for every 9 marijuana users - and 130,000 people use heroin monthly, or 1 for every 80 regular marijuana users.

[Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, US Dept. of Health and Human Services, National Household Survey on Drug Use 2000 (Washington, DC: SAMHSA, 2001]

The Journal of the American Medical Association features an article on 'gateway theory' in its Jan. 22/29, 2003 edition. According to the article, "Early Onset of Drug Use in Early-Onset Cannabis Users vs. Co-twin Controls," " While the findings of this study indicate that early cannabis use is associated with increased risks of progression to other illicit drug use and drug abuse/dependence, it is not possible to draw strong causal conclusions solely on the basis of the associations shown in this study."

http://www.drugwardistortions.org/distortion7.htm

http://www.drugwardistortions.org/

The gateway theory is heavily disputed.

http://www.drugactionnetwork.com/

http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/action/

It's a fundamental societal issue. Education needs to improve. Good luck on the house search Foxy.

[Foxy]

Thanks, Decupld too dangerous for me and the kits here. I agree with what someone else said. Most know that I live here in the park, just moved here in October. I had a better background check done getting my job than to move in here. Oh well. If the owners don't want to do anything, what can one do? When the cops are at the managers house as often as anyone else's and they give warnings to other tenants and give them a 24th chance what can one do????
This one can MOVE...
As far as Marijuana being a gateway drug... I don't care, the point is that it IS AS OF TODAY ILLEGAL!!! Therefore, I say GREAT JOB Law Enforcement!! I am grateful that the Sheriff and the MPD are now working together. "Bout time!!
Also, I doubt very much that these guys are "only" buying, selling, using, Marijuana. I am sure they are into other things, especially since at least one of them had a previous charge for cocaine possession. So in this thread there is no argument as to whether or not it is a gateway drug. Cause I don't care!

[DecupldSolutions]

Cause I don't care!

Oh. Well then things won't change then if no one cares.

I'll care for you.

[Foxy]

Maybe I should clarify, I don't care whether or not it is a gateway drug, the fact remains that it is illegal. Anything can be a gateway drug, many start out taking prescribed meds and then go to illegal ones. I have Lupus, and one "remedy" was that I could get a prescription for Marijuana, I have no use for it.

BTW
Sorry if I sound snappy lately, it is the 56+ hours I worked this week...lol...got me one of those job things...they suck!! lmbo

[Chuck]

Even after Marijuana is legalized it will still be a gateway drug. But for you to understand this you need to also understand that alcohol is a gateway drug and it is legalized. Not every person that uses alcohol takes the next step to Marijuana nor does everyone that uses Marijuana take the next step to cocaine. History shows that the mass majority do.

Much like gambling, I have the same stance on the drug legalization issue. I am indifferent. If illicit drugs are legalized we would not have drug dealers, that is a fact. But they are and we do.

The 60's and the 70's proved one thing. The people cannot get drugs legalized. It takes the people that run the country to do that. They will probably not do that anytime soon. There is big money on both sides of the line. Even big time dealers don't want any drugs legalized because there would be no more big time profits. It is only the end user that pushes for legalization and they are not the voice that is heard.

One thing holds true. Legalizing drug of any kind will not stop crime. People will still rob and kill for them, even if they are made cheaper by legalization.

[DecupldSolutions]

First of all, please do not take this as criticism of our local law enforcement personnel. Crimes were committed and justice will be served. The facts of this case are as such and not known by anyone unrelated to it. No claims are asserted as to anyone's guilt or innocence or whether or not certain things are deserved. Our local law enforcement services are very good and have been as long as I have been here. I salute their efforts. If there is a lesson to be learned from the article kids, it might be "Buckle up" eh? But this is an opportunity to discuss the challenges presented to us as a society. So here we go.


Even after Marijuana is legalized it will still be a gateway drug. But for you to understand this you need to also understand that alcohol is a gateway drug and it is legalized. Not every person that uses alcohol takes the next step to Marijuana nor does everyone that uses Marijuana take the next step to cocaine. History shows that the mass majority do.

The study mentioned above shows it is not a gateway drug. No more than any other. This is an appeal to belief, be it your own or the one of the masses. In which case, it would be more of an appeal to popularity, or some other appeal. Nothing verifiable there stated. History shows this? Where? Do you have some reference?

Much like gambling, I have the same stance on the drug legalization issue. I am indifferent. If illicit drugs are legalized we would not have drug dealers, that is a fact. But they are and we do.

Ok.?. Merck, Pfizer, Eli Lily, Bayer, etc... Oh we still got dealers given regulation. But at least the machine still gets greased and would be, very completely to be sure.

The 60's and the 70's proved one thing. The people cannot get drugs legalized. It takes the people that run the country to do that. They will probably not do that anytime soon. There is big money on both sides of the line. Even big time dealers don't want any drugs legalized because there would be no more big time profits. It is only the end user that pushes for legalization and they are not the voice that is heard.

You're right Merck, Pfizer, GSK, Eli Lily... none of these coporate entities with the rights of a person want alternatives. A lot of things were still legal in those days of woodstock and vietnam. The people get drug regulation and a means to an end by voicing their opinion whilst voting for the quality candidate who will enact just policy. That is voting to be heard. And the appeals are being made more effectively and frequently more often. References available. Would be nice to see higher quality candidates for public service. A whole new conversation there. It is not only the end user. MAPP, NORML, DAN, LEAP are all groups composed of all walks of life. Voices are heard. Many economists endorse regulation for many reasons; to name just one subset other than: end users.

One thing holds true. Legalizing drug of any kind will not stop crime. People will still rob and kill for them, even if they are made cheaper by legalization.

Really? Must have missed that memo. Got any proof? Is that the appeal to fear, hasty generalization or questionable cause? Cheaper isn't quite the goal. The price would be based on a lot of factors. There is a model if we are interested in discussing it.

Q: I've seen crime increase with alcohol use too, especially violent crimes like wife beatings, sexual assaults, shootings, etc., not to mention thousands of terrible accidents every year. Legalizing alcohol didn't stop the crime related problems it causes. Why do you want to increase those problems? Isn't it bad enough that we have people high on alcohol, causing problems?

A: This is an excellent point, and a "sticking point" for many people who might otherwise oppose prohibition. There is no doubt that a small percentage of the people that use alcohol abuse it. This is true of many drugs, and especially true of an extremely disorienting potentially addictive drug like alcohol.

However, if you study history, you'll see that the thirteen-year era of alcohol prohibition actually made matters much much worse. In fact, prohibition was an unmitigated disaster. Crime skyrocketed, corruption spread through government and police forces, gang violence soared, riddling our streets with bullets. Poorly distilled and unregulated "bathtub gin" blinded and killed people -- both "addicts" and "casual recreational users".

But most importantly, Prohibition did not stop people from drinking alcohol. While there was a drop in usage the first year, by the third year usage was greater than the year before prohibition. See this link for a handy chart:

http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa-157.html

Our point? Prohibition policies are based on fiction. They destroy society by creating an environment of crime and corruption, as well as giving government "Big Brother" powers over the lives, recreational habits, and choices of all citizens.

And prohibition policies create vast bureaucracies. And the lies and propaganda which these bureaucracies must create and disseminate, in order to prop up their fiction, can cause aware and thinking people to develop a tragic deep and permanent distrust of the government, of the hardworking people in law enforcement, and of the political process.

Prohibition and the forces that support it are enemies of liberty and domestic tranquility. While there may be issues with the use, and sometimes abuse, of various recreational drugs like alcohol, those issues and those people that abuse should be dealt with directly, instead of creating an unregulated black market that feeds the mouth of crime. That is all prohibition has ever done, and will ever do.

[Chuck]

First off you posed a site that is filled with bad spyware so the link is removed.


The study mentioned above shows it is not a gateway drug. No more than any other. This is an appeal to belief, be it your own or the one of the masses. In which case, it would be more of an appeal to popularity, or some other appeal. Nothing verifiable there stated. History shows this? Where? Do you have some reference?

Cigarettes are a gateway drug. The FDA. History shows that the majority kids in high school that smoke drink. The majority of that group say that the have tried Marijuana the majority of that group say that they have tried cocaine. All drugs are a gateway to experiment with other drugs.



OK.?. Merck, Pfizer, Eli Lily, Bayer, etc... Oh we still got dealers given regulation. But at least the machine still gets greased and would be, very completely to be sure.

Redundant arguement...




Really? Must have missed that memo. Got any proof? Is that the appeal to fear, hasty generalization or questionable cause? Cheaper isn't quite the goal. The price would be based on a lot of factors. There is a model if we are interested in discussing it.

People still rob and kill for alcohol on the streets. Read the big city papers. Watch the news. Headlines: Man killed on beach for $1.35. Suspect says he needed cigarettes.

This is all redundant. You are asking me to argue my opinion based from what I have learned and I am not going to fill 3 pages of debate. I plan on sticking my ground as I am am sure you plan to stand yours. I am good with that and your opinion.

Now I am not trying to be rude cause I love a good debate but I am just really busy. Must of this information you have posted I have read and I am still not pro the legalization of drugs. It is one of my few Republican traits. Probably from being a cop in Bakersfield and seeing 1st had the cause and affect of this topic.

Anyway you are a smart person and I much rather challenge with you on a topic we can have a more direct affect.

[bdr]

Marijuana is a gateway drug like religion is a gateway psychosis....

Thats all I have to say about that.
LOL

BDR

[TheMan]

Well said Bdr....

[kileyrowland74]

As I think someone already pointed out, marijuana is no more a gateway drug than alcohol (or Tylenol or aspirin, in my opinion and experience). Also, you have to want to walk through the gate . . .

People who *need* to abuse drugs (or alcohol or food or etc.) to relax or deal with their lives have problems. Personally, I can't figure out why pot is still illegal and booze isn't. (In my life, I have seen A LOT more damage done to individuals and their families by alcohol. A lot!)

[mark]

People who *need* to abuse drugs (or alcohol or food or etc.) to relax or deal with their lives have problems.

I agree with you here, they are weak for sure.


Personally, I can't figure out why pot is still illegal and booze isn't. (In my life, I have seen A LOT more damage done to individuals and their families by alcohol. A lot!)

This one is easy to answer.

I use this statement here often & that is........follow the money trail.

There is no one out there with any credibility to lobby for "weed".

Unlike the alcohol industry, they are very powerful & have lot's of money to basically get what they want.......not to mention that quite a few politicians love their alcohol which doesn't help either............see ya mark

[kileyrowland74]

I agree with you here, they are weak for sure.

Mark - I am just now reading back through this thread. I think all people are weak at some point in their lives and need some "substance" to help them cope. I hope it did not come across that I was being judgemental. (I am trying to work on that -- it's difficult! lol) Personally, throughout my life I have used drugs, booze, Jesus, food, exercise and relationships to *attempt* to deal with my problems. (Only facing them and dealing with them works in the end, in my experience.) If someone seems to be getting/taking too much of anything that is usually indicative of problems, IMO -- but not necessarily flat-out weakness. Just that weakness that we sometimes lapse into because of the Human Condition -- whatever that is.

"This one is easy to answer.

I use this statement here often & that is........follow the money trail.

There is no one out there with any credibility to lobby for "weed".

Unlike the alcohol industry, they are very powerful & have lot's of money to basically get what they want.......not to mention that quite a few politicians love their alcohol which doesn't help either............see ya mark

Mark - I think you are probably right about the credibility/money factors. Also, I think that, historically, racism and classism were attached to marijuana and those probably came into play, too. (Marijuana has *historically* been the illegal drug of choice for poor whites and blacks, Hispanics, and the "youth culture" -- as well as artists/writers and "the counter culture" folks. I say historically because I am not up on current drug culture and don't know what is going on now. Maybe pot has fallen out of favor.) Finally, I am willing to bet that a lot of politicians smoke pot -- AND that they inhale while they are doing it! :eek:

[mark]

Mark - I think you are probably right about the credibility/money factors. Also, I think that, historically, racism and classism were attached to marijuana and those probably came into play, too. (Marijuana has *historically* been the illegal drug of choice for poor whites and blacks, Hispanics, and the "youth culture" -- as well as artists/writers and "the counter culture" folks. I say historically because I am not up on current drug culture and don't know what is going on now. Maybe pot has fallen out of favor.) Finally, I am willing to bet that a lot of politicians smoke pot -- AND that they inhale while they are doing it! :eek:

............excellent response!
I think Pot is generally cheap compared to harsher drugs & that's probably why it's so widespread.

I couldn't agree more with your response..............see ya mark

[RHP Studios]

Hill City is for the most part rental property, Right? So, like Confucius I'm also wondering how a known covicted drug dealer slipped by the screening process. Anyone have a guess...gotta jet.

my question because I don't understand what the owners of the property have to do with this entire story - is it against the law to rent to someone who has a criminal record? Would almost seem like that would violate their rights and would be considered discrimination. If it is against the law, then why do we even have rehabilitation?

[Foxy]

Not sure about illegal, but you can choose to not rent to someone that is convicted of crimes. For instance, I know someone that works at the Maysville Housing Authority, and I know that if you have any kind of criminal background then you can't rent from there. So why would it be different at the trailer park, apartment complex, or personal rental house? The law says that you cannot discriminate against a renter for age, religious, ethnic, or disability, don't remember anything in the anti discrimination laws about criminal convictions.

[Chuck]

Owners of property do bare some responsibility to whom they rent. The could even jeopardize the ownership of their property under Federal Seizer laws if Law Enforcement can prove prior knowledge.

As a peace officer I have proven prior knowledge of a landlord to a Federal Court and seized rental property. They do have a burden of responsibility (or did have) over their renters if they have knowledge of the illegal activities..

Although a criminal record does not constitute absolute proof it does show past conduct if activities of the same crime are continued. You must also establish absolute proof that the owner had knowledge that the activities were continuing on his property and that the landlord had no intention to intervene or evict to stop the activities on his rental property.

It takes 100's of man hours to do these type of seizures and most dept. cannot afford the vestment especially if they lose the case.