'Intelligent design' and local schools

[ponto]

Gov. Ernie Fletcher is urging teachers to tell their students about the "self-evident truth" of intelligent design, the idea that a Supreme Being has guided the development of life on earth.

Some teachers have said they don't try to change any minds, but they make sure they know the theory so these kids can score the best they can on the (statewide standardized) test.

Since 1990, Kentucky law has allowed educators to teach both evolution and "the theory of creation as presented in the Bible."

In his speech last week, Fletcher, an ordained Baptist minister, said intelligent design isn't a religious doctrine. "This is not a question about faith or religion. It's about self-evident truth," he said.

But a federal judge appointed by President Bush reached the opposite conclusion last month, throwing out a Dover, Pa., school board policy which mandated the teaching of intelligent design.

Intelligent design isn't mentioned in the state's core curriculum, it isn't spelled out in the state-approved textbooks and it isn't taught in college-level biology courses.

Did you know that 1999 the Kentucky Department of Education replaced "evolution" with the phrase "change over time" in science curriculum guidelines.

State officials said at the time that the terms meant the same thing and that "change over time" would be less controversial wording to parents whose religious beliefs clash with the theory of evolution.

What do you think?

[Chuck]

'Intelligent design', I though that got to do with the Japanese and computer stuff? (Not Really)

I am a big opposer of 'No Name Change to Candy Coat' I basically don't want to be force feed evolution or religion.

In my opinion they can have both type classes in school then make them electives. That way I can have a choice.

Taking away one and allowing the other is just wrong.

I might have this whole 'Intelligent design' thing mixed up. That is because these people that make these decisions can't make up there mind or focus.

CALL EVERYTHING SOMETHING WE ALL CAN UNDERSTAND AND STICK WITH IT... Your confusing us.

An original quote from Chuck:
I hate saying something to someone only to upset them cause I was NOT notified of a name change for their Race, Religion or Sex.

[Anonymous Coward]

They are not changing the name of anything, this is a whole new name. They want to teach that there is a possible explaination not based on science, but based on "supernatural". Anything that cannot be explained by "science", i.e.; something that can be tested and falsifiable, and sensed with the 5 senses is in science called "supernatural" I think that there is a place for "intelligent design" in schools. I do not think there is a place for "God is creator of all". at least not in public schools. If you want your child to learn that God is the creator than allow your child to attend a religious based private school. Now Fletcher wants to teach that it is God. Other representatives want it to just be a "greater" thing that created the world.
The phrase "change over time" is the definition of Evolution leaving out only that in evolution includes that the change is caused to allow for the betterment of the species, i.e.; the snake looses legs because it makes it a better predator, better predator eats more and can survive to make more. (BTW.. if you X-Ray a boa by it's tale it has the remanents of leg bones.) For me I believe in God, that is faith. I also believe that there were dinosaurs, I have seen eviedence many times including the Smithsonian in D.C., I also believe in evolution, althought not the "monkey to man" kind, but the kind we have documented proof of such as snakes that once had legs, and many others that have been proven, those are "science". Science and religion are 2 seperate things.

[DecupldSolutions]

Ha ha ha....

what is needed is an intelligent government design

at the least, it's good for a laugh.

[tkcomer]

Study after study shows a large percentage of the kids graduate with out even knowing the fundamentals of math, science, history, etc. Why throw something else at them before they have a grasp at what they need to know to do good in the world? To me, this is a diversion tactic. These are tricks used by politicians to get people worked up and get support from religious groups so the people don’t noticed the underhanded dealings that the they are really doing. It’s one of the oldest magician tricks in the world. They get you to focus on one hand so you don’t notice what the other hand is doing.

[Foxy]

I see your point TKomer, there was never an "order" to put "Intelligent Design" in our science classes, but my high school, and even college biology and zoology classes often discussed the "intelligent design" theory, though it was not called that.

[Jeremy]

What's Behind It:

The Discovery Institute, the largest promoter of Intelligent Design, is backed by a man named Howard Ahmanson. Ahmanson is a savings and loan heir with deep pockets and has maintained a long-time relationship with Christian Reconstructionism, an extreme faction of the Religious Right that seeks to replace American democracy with a harsh fundamentalist theocracy. Reconstructionists believe conservative Christians should take "dominion" over American society. Under their version of "biblical law," the death penalty would be required for over a dozen categories of offenders, including adulterers, homosexuals, witches, incorrigible children and those who spread "false" religions. They regard the teaching of evolution as part of a "war against Genesis." Basically what you'll end up with if they get their way is a Christian version of the former Iraqi and Afghanistan governments.

There is little doubt that the Ahmansons have the resources to help finance anti-evolution efforts. The family's wealth grew exponentially during the 1950s and '60s when Howard Ahmanson Sr, made billions in the savings and loan industry. After his death, his estate was divided between his son Howard F. Ahmanson and the Ahmanson Foundation, which had $663 million in assets at the end of 1996. (H.F. Ahmanson & Co., the parent company of Home Savings of America, had over $47 billion in assets in 1997.)

With a vast fortune in hand, the Ahmansons are playing an active role in ensuring the anti-evolution movement's success.

According to Reason magazine, promotional materials from the Seattle-based Discovery Institute acknowledge that the Ahmanson family donated $1.5 million to the Institute's Center for the Renewal of Science and Culture for a research and publicity program to "unseat not just Darwinism but also Darwinism's cultural legacy." In fact, the August 1999 issue of the Discovery Institute's Journal recognizes an Ahmanson outfit for providing the Center's start-up funds.

My Views:

It's a waste of everyone's time. Biology is a 7th grade class in most areas. By the time most people have reached 7th grade, they have already formed their opinion about the world around them. Waste of time, money, and totally political at the expense of kids.

[tkcomer]

I still think the public schools should stick to the core subjects, reading writing and arithmetic. I lot of science is just another version of math. And yes, theories. And if you can’t pass one subject, no extracurricular activities. And at the end of the year, if you still can’t pass, you don’t move forward. If you want to expand your horizons, and have the money, go to college. Or go to the library. If I’m struggling in science class, a teacher saying God created this or that won’t help me pass. A little more time on the subject at hand might.

[DecupldSolutions]

Theories can be proven/disproved by experiment. That is what makes it theory. It seems many people don't realize this.

Intellegent design is a hypothesis. Still, it is clear that the earth is much older than 6,000 years.

Our kids are losing a battle of wits with kids all around the world. Due to low levels of acheivment?

http://www.reason.com/hod/js011306.shtml

[ponto]

If people evolved from apes, why are there still apes?

[Jeremy]

That's not how it works. People get hung up on the ape thing, but really the idea is that people evolved from single-celled organisms, and there are still those. It's not that something disappears after it evolves but rather that a new species splits off from the old. If the old species can still survive then it remains. If the new species can also survive then it thrives as well.

An example is snakes. Snakes have been tracked down to older versions of reptiles that had tiny legs and then further back to walking reptiles. Just because there are now snakes doesn't mean that there are no longer any walking reptiles.

Apes themselves are tracked back to early mammals, which are then tracked back to birds, which are tracked back to reptiles, which are tracked back to fish, which are tracked back to ... and it goes on to single-celled organisms.

Another thing that people don't usually think of is that the evolutionary process is still ongoing. In human beings, over time, we have become taller for example. Our pinky toes, which have been shown to have little purpose have become smaller. Most likely future versions of humans won't have them at all. Often we look at the evolutionary scale and say everything evolved from single-celled organisms until one day, ta da! Humans were around. But that's not how it works either. Evolutions isn't a product resulting in humans. It's a process that will result in even higher forms than human.

[Foxy]

Well if the theroy of evolution is correct, then your answer is simple. Trying to type it may not be. The process of evolution takes years and years, select "species" can evolve. So the apes that are not evolved into humans did not need to change, the system of life they were using was working for them. For instance, staying on the monkey theme, there are Chimpanzee in the wild that live on the same continent. On one side, you have apes that use tools, and their thought process is greater than that of the apes on other side. If you look at apes, you have Gorillas, Chimps, Orangutans, etc. They are not exactly the same, each has evolved to survive in it's environment. And that is not counting the hundreds of species of monkey. Yes, apes and monkeys are different, the obvious difference is that monkeys have a tail, apes do not. Each has evolved. I hope this makes since to someone who is reading it...lol... as long as I meant what I knew it is all good!!

[Foxy]

We have got to get together Jeremy! I love talking about this stuff!!
And you are correct, snakes even now, when X-Rayed, have "leg" bones near their tail. Many people don't know that.